> ... you wind up with a user base of 10 principled free speech activists, and a million people with truly awful views
The problem of a leftist network like BlueSky is that so many people on it defend the totally indefensible. I'll give two examples...
1. Like all those who have a "preference" for young kids: it's nicknamed "PedoSky" for a reason.
You ain't finding me on a network that explains that wanting to have sex with young kids is "just a preference" and that explains that people selling drugs to kids aren't evil for it's all "contextual".
2. There are 300 million female who been genitally mutilated that are alive today. Because the west imported so many people from the middle east and africa, that issue of FGM is present in the West too.
And instead of fighting it, you now have some western "intellectuals" (or at least who believe they are educated intellectuals) explaining that "it's a complex problem".
That's where we are atm: people lecturing us about how we should be respectful of the culture where young girl's clit are removed "because it's complex / because it's contextual / because we need to understand the beautiful things about those cultures / etc.".
No it's not: it's a good vs evil issue.
If you genitally mutilate a young girl by cutting her clitoris or if you sell fenthanyl to teenagers, you are fucking evil. It's as in the TV series Euphoria:
"I don't care what your personal struggles are: if you sell poison to kids, you are evil".
I don't have X anymore but from I can see X is mild compared to the ideas defended on BlueSky.
It can be summed up as: "Musk is a nazi. I defend female genital mutilation because it's complex, I understand grow up men who have a preference for young kids, I believe we should pardon dealers selling drugs to kids for they have their own struggles, I sympathetize with islamist terrorism, ... And it's all OK because I'm so open-minded individual, while Musk is an evil nazi".
While I do believe that at some point it's a good vs evil issue (and I'm not religious) and you have to take an actual stance on those issues instead of weaseling your way out of it by "understanding the feelings" of pedos/terrorists/fenthanyl dealers etc.
Once again, they’re severely discounting socialization over the internet. Twitch, discord, et al account for massive amounts of socialization. For many kids it’s easier to chat or stream than it is to find the other 2-3 weird kids into their particular hobby. Watch the TV documentary “Social Studies” if you think Gen Z isn’t partying. “Euphoria” is definitely an exaggeration but it’s relatable to Gen Z for a reason. Anecdotally, I see Genz all the time at raves and concerts. These aren’t “animal house” style events but still.
There is value in that. One thing is tradition and one thing is media or history. I agree that traditions and culture should advance but by means of creating new things not overwritting existing ones.
The Wire would not be the wire without the accent, manerisms including slurs, drugs and police brutality.
Dazed & Confused would not be the same without the 70s issues and fortunes but you have the show Skins replacing those with the 2000 "revisions" or Euphoria with the 2020 ones. There is no need to rewrite any of those.
It could be argued that in movies like Blade Runner the rapey scene of Deckard and Rachel does not add anything to the story or characters. Ignoring the technical difficulty of changing those scenes without altering the story narrative or the character morals and flaws at the end of the day is a product of it's time with it's flaws.
In this case it was designed that way on purpose although I consider the reasons weak and it could have been done better if that was the intent. It doesn't help that the actress did not enjoy making the scene. https://youtu.be/vIdlYzbugT8?t=261
It can also be interpreted as Deckard being a lowlife scum that purposely rapes Rachel taking advantage of the fact that she is being hunted, he is the only one who is going to protect her and she knows it.
In this case maybe not you or me would care if the scene was rewritten but I'm sure someone trying to study older movies, a director or Harrison Ford cuestionable love scenes would if only the rewritten movie had survived.
If remakes add something to the table it's the ability to reimagine stories in a less flawed way by our standards without deleting the past.
TLDR; rewriting media is very nuanced and we should take the easy way out of remaking it or creating new stuff instead.
You're demonstrating nothing but your own hyper-fixation on superficial identity characteristics by failing to recognize that there are plenty of "women, LGBT, PoC, etc" in all kinds of media beloved by those who are sick and tired of woke media. You think that these characteristics are sufficient for people to dislike this media, whereas the precise inverse seems to be true, wherein pro-woke people seem to be perfectly happy accepting garbage as media so long as these identity groups and messages are present.
I'm not interested in continuing this conversation by taking some kind of boomer position on wokeness, I just think that you're willfully arguing in bad faith, but you already know that.
This explains feelings I’ve had watching Euphoria. I’ve noticed a worsening physiological response just watching the show, so haven’t finished season 2.
Initially I felt there was some catharsis to get out of it, but I’ve had to stop myself and ask what the effects really are. More cortisol? Less shock from real trauma? I’m not sure.
Yet I was drawn in by the trauma, and the thought - formed somewhere in my mind - that these dark, traumatic things were more authentic, and so there was something real and authentic to get out of watching it. But so far, there isn’t much of a thesis, or something, to really think about and learn from. So I’m done for now.
It's an homage. It's easier to argue the "rip-off" case when the movie being stenciled is commercially successful, like when 2 Days in the Valley tried to ride the success of Pulp Fiction. Filmmakers are film nerds and they reference other works constantly, given the freedom (I'm watching Euphoria on HBO and suddenly there's a tracking shot lifted from the 1927 silent film Wings?). I like identifying these homages and connecting the linage of the art form. A few years ago I made an algo for it that doubles as a recommendation engine: https://cinetrii.com/
Also this https://www.imdb.com/chart/tvmeter/?ref_=tt_ov_pop list has Euphoria as #2 (formerly #1), although to be fair Abbott is not on the list, and I'm personally not familiar with Pieces of Her. So fair enough, might be overestimating for Abbott - but it is on ABC so perhaps relevant to average people. And of all of these shows mentioned, I've only seen The Dragon Prince - I'm only aware of the other ones via discussions.
Aside from what my sibling comment said about a fantasy world, why'd you pick Zoey's Extraordinary Playlist and The Dragon Prince? Surely shows like Abbott Elementary and Euphoria would be more culturally relevant? Or recent animated movies Encanto and Turning Red?
And even as far as the Dragon Prince is concerned, it's interesting how you mention it as overrepresentation when much of the diversity is relegated to secondary characters. Callum, Rayla, Claudia, Soren and Viren are all white (elves are in some ways minority coded, but the British accent makes that remain firmly in the realm of coding), and seem to be straight and cisgender.
I personally love stories with "overrepresentation" - and not only just to make up for a massive history of erasure and underrepresentation. It makes me so happy to hear people saying "I usually don't feel seen, but THIS character, they look/sound/act like me!" Honestly, as a gay man I still don't feel especially seen - and as far as gay characters I feel connected to beyond just that, it's pretty limited. I can think of maybe... 4 main characters? And they're all in the past few years.
Airing 1 or 2 episodes a week gives maximum opportunity for a show to be successful, esp if it's a smaller show that doesn't have a built in audience (ie. if it's not a Marvel/Disney show or returning seasons of successful shows). Airing weekly means that there is an ongoing conversation around your show (if it's any good) and each media outlet is potentially writing about your show n times as opposed to writing about your show 1 time reviewing the entire thing, that results in more chances for the audience finding your show. The cancelling the service thing is at best a secondary concern. Moreover creators of many show prefer that their show be consumed on a week to week basis as opposed to binged in 1 sitting with little opportunity for the audience to reflect on it.
HBO has mastered that art of "1 episode a week to maximize the audience and buzz of what appears to be a niche show" even on their streaming service and as a result have found unconventional hits like Euphoria, The White Lotus, Succession, The Leftovers which would otherwise have been lost in the glut of peak tv abyss if they were just dropped in one night.
I really hope Netflix proves everyone wrong. HBO and Disney+ may have a huge advantage but neither seems interested in the tech side. Disney+ may be OK now (it's been a while since I checked) but HBO Max seems to be extremely inconsistent when it comes to streaming quality. Even new, popular shows like Euphoria on HBO Max are only 1080p with a bitrate so low that the frequent, dimly lit scenes are a blocky mess. At the same time, AAA movies like Dune stream in nearly Bluray quality. Meanwhile even dumb reality shows on Netflix still stream with suburb quality.
IMO assuming Netflix doubles down on original content which seems to be the assumed direction, they have two strategies. Strategy one is to produce/distribute content that is developed outside the US where production is much cheaper and existing production companies have less of an advantage. Partnering with local, smaller production outfits is probably a good strategy.
Strategy two is to use their tech advantage to lower the cost of content production. I'm quite surprised that we haven't seen Netflix create a Holodeck-esque production method. The Mandalorian (Disney+/Holodeck) and The Witcher Season 1(Netflix) have somewhat similar production costs per episode at ~$15M and ~$10M respectively but The Mandalorian had significantly more and better CG then The Witcher so clearly the Holodeck method has a lot of benefits and cost savings.
That said Squid Game only had a total budget of ~$21M, although a lot lighter on CG, strategy one offers a more cost savings.
Hacker Cinema
14 comments on Hacker News
> ... you wind up with a user base of 10 principled free speech activists, and a million people with truly awful views
The problem of a leftist network like BlueSky is that so many people on it defend the totally indefensible. I'll give two examples...
1. Like all those who have a "preference" for young kids: it's nicknamed "PedoSky" for a reason.
You ain't finding me on a network that explains that wanting to have sex with young kids is "just a preference" and that explains that people selling drugs to kids aren't evil for it's all "contextual".
2. There are 300 million female who been genitally mutilated that are alive today. Because the west imported so many people from the middle east and africa, that issue of FGM is present in the West too.
And instead of fighting it, you now have some western "intellectuals" (or at least who believe they are educated intellectuals) explaining that "it's a complex problem".
That's where we are atm: people lecturing us about how we should be respectful of the culture where young girl's clit are removed "because it's complex / because it's contextual / because we need to understand the beautiful things about those cultures / etc.".
No it's not: it's a good vs evil issue.
If you genitally mutilate a young girl by cutting her clitoris or if you sell fenthanyl to teenagers, you are fucking evil. It's as in the TV series Euphoria:
"I don't care what your personal struggles are: if you sell poison to kids, you are evil".
I don't have X anymore but from I can see X is mild compared to the ideas defended on BlueSky.
It can be summed up as: "Musk is a nazi. I defend female genital mutilation because it's complex, I understand grow up men who have a preference for young kids, I believe we should pardon dealers selling drugs to kids for they have their own struggles, I sympathetize with islamist terrorism, ... And it's all OK because I'm so open-minded individual, while Musk is an evil nazi".
While I do believe that at some point it's a good vs evil issue (and I'm not religious) and you have to take an actual stance on those issues instead of weaseling your way out of it by "understanding the feelings" of pedos/terrorists/fenthanyl dealers etc.
wtf you talk about? here's my example of searching latest euphoria episode:
i.postimg.cc/tJ2tMJYm/pb-example.jpg
Do you see any ads there?
You mean you don't use Firefox? Then that's on you bro!!
Once again, they’re severely discounting socialization over the internet. Twitch, discord, et al account for massive amounts of socialization. For many kids it’s easier to chat or stream than it is to find the other 2-3 weird kids into their particular hobby. Watch the TV documentary “Social Studies” if you think Gen Z isn’t partying. “Euphoria” is definitely an exaggeration but it’s relatable to Gen Z for a reason. Anecdotally, I see Genz all the time at raves and concerts. These aren’t “animal house” style events but still.
> I don't like the values I see in the 1990s TV shows.
You think the world is better off now that we've traded Family Matters and Step by Step for the likes of Euphoria?
Exactly. And big-budget movies are trying to maximize their audience, that's all that's happening.
If you want something adult and horny, there's plenty for you on HBO and so forth. Euphoria, Game of Thrones, The Idol...
There is value in that. One thing is tradition and one thing is media or history. I agree that traditions and culture should advance but by means of creating new things not overwritting existing ones.
The Wire would not be the wire without the accent, manerisms including slurs, drugs and police brutality.
Dazed & Confused would not be the same without the 70s issues and fortunes but you have the show Skins replacing those with the 2000 "revisions" or Euphoria with the 2020 ones. There is no need to rewrite any of those.
It could be argued that in movies like Blade Runner the rapey scene of Deckard and Rachel does not add anything to the story or characters. Ignoring the technical difficulty of changing those scenes without altering the story narrative or the character morals and flaws at the end of the day is a product of it's time with it's flaws.
In this case it was designed that way on purpose although I consider the reasons weak and it could have been done better if that was the intent. It doesn't help that the actress did not enjoy making the scene. https://youtu.be/vIdlYzbugT8?t=261
It can also be interpreted as Deckard being a lowlife scum that purposely rapes Rachel taking advantage of the fact that she is being hunted, he is the only one who is going to protect her and she knows it.
In this case maybe not you or me would care if the scene was rewritten but I'm sure someone trying to study older movies, a director or Harrison Ford cuestionable love scenes would if only the rewritten movie had survived.
If remakes add something to the table it's the ability to reimagine stories in a less flawed way by our standards without deleting the past.
TLDR; rewriting media is very nuanced and we should take the easy way out of remaking it or creating new stuff instead.
Euphoria? Excellent show.
Reservation Dogs? Excellent show.
Dear White People? Woke Garbage.
Kill Bill? Excellent movie.
Captain Marvel? Woke Garbage.
You're demonstrating nothing but your own hyper-fixation on superficial identity characteristics by failing to recognize that there are plenty of "women, LGBT, PoC, etc" in all kinds of media beloved by those who are sick and tired of woke media. You think that these characteristics are sufficient for people to dislike this media, whereas the precise inverse seems to be true, wherein pro-woke people seem to be perfectly happy accepting garbage as media so long as these identity groups and messages are present.
I'm not interested in continuing this conversation by taking some kind of boomer position on wokeness, I just think that you're willfully arguing in bad faith, but you already know that.
This explains feelings I’ve had watching Euphoria. I’ve noticed a worsening physiological response just watching the show, so haven’t finished season 2.
Initially I felt there was some catharsis to get out of it, but I’ve had to stop myself and ask what the effects really are. More cortisol? Less shock from real trauma? I’m not sure.
Yet I was drawn in by the trauma, and the thought - formed somewhere in my mind - that these dark, traumatic things were more authentic, and so there was something real and authentic to get out of watching it. But so far, there isn’t much of a thesis, or something, to really think about and learn from. So I’m done for now.
edit: formatting
It's an homage. It's easier to argue the "rip-off" case when the movie being stenciled is commercially successful, like when 2 Days in the Valley tried to ride the success of Pulp Fiction. Filmmakers are film nerds and they reference other works constantly, given the freedom (I'm watching Euphoria on HBO and suddenly there's a tracking shot lifted from the 1927 silent film Wings?). I like identifying these homages and connecting the linage of the art form. A few years ago I made an algo for it that doubles as a recommendation engine: https://cinetrii.com/
I'm not a twitter user, but I would think these stats speak to some measure of pop-cultural relevancy?
"‘Euphoria’ Is the Most-Tweeted TV Show of the Decade (So Far)"
https://variety.com/2022/digital/news/euphoria-most-tweeted-tv-show-1235190599/
and
"‘Abbott Elementary’ Is No. 1 Most-Tweeted TV Comedy of the Year to Date"
https://news.yahoo.com/abbott-elementary-no-1-most-171433284.html
Also this https://www.imdb.com/chart/tvmeter/?ref_=tt_ov_pop list has Euphoria as #2 (formerly #1), although to be fair Abbott is not on the list, and I'm personally not familiar with Pieces of Her. So fair enough, might be overestimating for Abbott - but it is on ABC so perhaps relevant to average people. And of all of these shows mentioned, I've only seen The Dragon Prince - I'm only aware of the other ones via discussions.
Aside from what my sibling comment said about a fantasy world, why'd you pick Zoey's Extraordinary Playlist and The Dragon Prince? Surely shows like Abbott Elementary and Euphoria would be more culturally relevant? Or recent animated movies Encanto and Turning Red?
And even as far as the Dragon Prince is concerned, it's interesting how you mention it as overrepresentation when much of the diversity is relegated to secondary characters. Callum, Rayla, Claudia, Soren and Viren are all white (elves are in some ways minority coded, but the British accent makes that remain firmly in the realm of coding), and seem to be straight and cisgender.
I personally love stories with "overrepresentation" - and not only just to make up for a massive history of erasure and underrepresentation. It makes me so happy to hear people saying "I usually don't feel seen, but THIS character, they look/sound/act like me!" Honestly, as a gay man I still don't feel especially seen - and as far as gay characters I feel connected to beyond just that, it's pretty limited. I can think of maybe... 4 main characters? And they're all in the past few years.
Airing 1 or 2 episodes a week gives maximum opportunity for a show to be successful, esp if it's a smaller show that doesn't have a built in audience (ie. if it's not a Marvel/Disney show or returning seasons of successful shows). Airing weekly means that there is an ongoing conversation around your show (if it's any good) and each media outlet is potentially writing about your show n times as opposed to writing about your show 1 time reviewing the entire thing, that results in more chances for the audience finding your show. The cancelling the service thing is at best a secondary concern. Moreover creators of many show prefer that their show be consumed on a week to week basis as opposed to binged in 1 sitting with little opportunity for the audience to reflect on it.
HBO has mastered that art of "1 episode a week to maximize the audience and buzz of what appears to be a niche show" even on their streaming service and as a result have found unconventional hits like Euphoria, The White Lotus, Succession, The Leftovers which would otherwise have been lost in the glut of peak tv abyss if they were just dropped in one night.
I really hope Netflix proves everyone wrong. HBO and Disney+ may have a huge advantage but neither seems interested in the tech side. Disney+ may be OK now (it's been a while since I checked) but HBO Max seems to be extremely inconsistent when it comes to streaming quality. Even new, popular shows like Euphoria on HBO Max are only 1080p with a bitrate so low that the frequent, dimly lit scenes are a blocky mess. At the same time, AAA movies like Dune stream in nearly Bluray quality. Meanwhile even dumb reality shows on Netflix still stream with suburb quality.
IMO assuming Netflix doubles down on original content which seems to be the assumed direction, they have two strategies. Strategy one is to produce/distribute content that is developed outside the US where production is much cheaper and existing production companies have less of an advantage. Partnering with local, smaller production outfits is probably a good strategy.
Strategy two is to use their tech advantage to lower the cost of content production. I'm quite surprised that we haven't seen Netflix create a Holodeck-esque production method. The Mandalorian (Disney+/Holodeck) and The Witcher Season 1(Netflix) have somewhat similar production costs per episode at ~$15M and ~$10M respectively but The Mandalorian had significantly more and better CG then The Witcher so clearly the Holodeck method has a lot of benefits and cost savings.
That said Squid Game only had a total budget of ~$21M, although a lot lighter on CG, strategy one offers a more cost savings.
If you want good content go watch the following TV shows (if you haven't already):
- Euphoria
- Bojack Horseman
- Atlanta
- Fleabag