Hacker Cinema
The Siege
1998 · Film · 116 min
Directed by Edward Zwick
The secret US abduction of a suspected terrorist from his Middle East homeland leads to a wave of terrorist attacks in New York. An FBI senior agent and his team attempt to locate and decommission the enemy cells, but must also deal with an Army General gone rogue and a female CIA agent of uncertain loyalties.
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11 comments on Hacker News
‘The Lives of Others’ is an outstanding film. However, it is a reappraisal of East German history and was made seven years after the collapse (the director grew up in West Germany and Western Europe).
US-America has looked at the subject of surveillance of its own population and its own (possible) collapse many times and often in a timely manner.
"The Conversation": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Conversation
"Enemy of the State": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enemy_of_the_State_(film)
"The Siege": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Siege
"In the Heat of the Night": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In_the_Heat_of_the_Night_(film)
"Eagle Eye": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eagle_Eye
If you ask publicly, ‘What if I've seen XYZ?’ then it's actually already too late.
> because of being told by the governments and in schools, that the CIA and co only fight terrorist and evil empires.
That's not their image in the US at all and that's not how formal education about the CIA works in schools in the US. The opposite is closer to the truth.
You're maybe aware of the common American conspiracy theory that JFK was murdered by the CIA? As retribution for the Bay of Pigs, among other things.
Every other Hollywood movie in which they make an appearance has portrayed the CIA as up to no good for decades now, especially when it comes to topics like the war on drugs and terrorism. They're frequently portrayed as duplicitous and incompetent. That's because that's how the culture views them at this point. They do not have a good reputation with the American public.
See: American Made (2017), Kill the Messenger (2014), Syriana (2005), The Siege (1998), The Jason Bourne movies, among many others
>>>This isn’t to say there wasn’t propaganda, just that the propaganda was pointed in a different direction: for example a young idealistic police officer working with an veteran of the force to tenaciously investigate an elusive criminal gang for the glory of the Soviet Union.
Interesting, the closest Western execution of this Soviet theme, albeit much more cynically, might be "Child 44", which was banned in much of the FSU and bombed: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Child_44_(film)
Personally I enjoyed it.
>>>American movies rarely have a true patriotic streak, as in “and this, son, is why we must work to better our union.”
"The Siege" might be one of the best for sticking to American values and trying to curb xenophobia. A big part of the plot is the importance of holding other Americans accountable for violations of our laws and our values, even when fighting against "foreign" enemies.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Siege
Hell of an underrated movie. If you liked The Siege but haven't seen Unthinkable, give that one a watch as well.
One of my favorite plot lines is where someone is an unexpected ally but then circumstances and conflicts of interest cause the alliance to become untenable. E.g. the movie "The Siege," General William Deveraux (Bruce Willis) reassures the protagonists, after a terrorist scare, that he's a "card-carrying member of the ACLU." But eventually, he's rounding U.S. citizens up into camps.
Big companies' alliances with social justice types strikes me as similar. It's tenable, to a point.
What's bad is that it was predicted, albeit more severely, in a movie about terrorism called The Siege. Starred Denzel Washington and Bruce Willis. Had attacks, the cell model of operation, the cops (Denzel) unable to do stuff, and the military (Bruce) called in to declare martial law. Some of the stuff Denzel said in the movie apply to America today. I highly recommend it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VzLQOc-B0Ys
Note: Key difference is America became both a surveillance state and a dual state. Dual state is when two governments, public and secret, operate in parallel with one able to bend/break rules to hit certain targets. This model is less likely to cause a revolution given most people never see the other side of things.
The pre-9/11 CIA/FBI power play detailed in your comment was portrayed to some degree in the 1998 movie "The Siege" by Denzel Washington. Any chance you've seen it before?
It has already been made (Under Siege) http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0133952/.
It is one of the most chilling movies I have ever seen, they were going to make a followup, about an attack on the World Trade Centers, but then reality court up with them.
The key takeaway is this: "Twenty-one percent of Americans disapprove of the government's actions, but say there could be circumstances in which it would be right for the government to carry out such a program, yielding a combined total of 58% of all Americans who either approve or could theoretically approve under certain circumstances."
I'd bet there are a lot of people in the administration who dislike the idea of surveillance in general, but approve of surveillance in this particular case because of the specifics of the situation. Not saying the belief is justified, but rather that this is always how such beliefs are justified. See the movie The Siege.
This reminds me of the 1998 movie The Siege. Terrorists are bombing New York and the politicians are discussing bringing in the army to hunt them down. Bruce Willis is a hard ass general and this is what he has to say on the subject:
"Make no mistake, Senator. We will hunt down the enemy, we will find the enemy, and we will kill the enemy. And no card-carrying member of the ACLU is more dead set against it than I am. Which is why I urge you - I implore you. Do not consider this as an option."
"There is historically nothing more corrosive to the morale of a population than policing its own citizens."
Many of the points in this excellent article made me think of the movie "The Siege."